In this interview with Lexi Schnaser, Amar Peterman, Director of the Ideos Center for Empathy in Christian and Public Life, discusses the importance of empathy, intellectual humility, and hospitality in public life. This interview has been edited for clarity and length.
By Amar Peterman and Lexi Schnaser
LS: What is the Center for Empathy in Christian and Public Life, and what was the motivation for its creation?
Amar Peterman, Director of the Ideos Center for Empathy in Christian and Public Life.
AP: The Center for Empathy in Christian and Public Life (CECPL) exists to equip Christians to faithfully, critically, and consistently engage with the complex issues in our society today. We do this through various programming that offers both practical resources and training for Christian leaders of all different levels, from organization directors and CEOs, all the way to lay leaders serving in their church in their local communities. We offer opportunities for these folks to be together and learn from one another and also receive training from experts and leaders in different Christian activism and organizations.
There were a lot of converging factors that brought the CECPL to life, and these factors were definitely expedited by the events of 2020 and what we've seen in 2021. The short story is that Christy Vines, the President and CEO of Ideos, and I felt a strong call to use our resources, gifts, and talents to equip Christians to better engage in the world. And so Christy, of course, had already founded the Ideos Institute, but my main outlet was writing. I actually had written a couple pieces for Shared Justice and a few other platforms. Using things I'd written in my undergraduate degree, I'm a seminary student now at Princeton Seminary, and what I learned in the classroom and my papers and such to try to turn it into something that could help equip the church, bring it from the academy, down to a more local level. I was doing that, but when January 6 of this year rolled around and we saw the Capitol insurrection in D.C., that really brought all of this to a head. I was visiting family in Green Bay, Wisconsin, and we watched on TV with everyone else, following the news broadcasts.
As we saw Christians, and especially my own fellow evangelicals, storming the Capitol with Confederate flags, hanging nooses outside of the Capitol building, and reenacting George Floyd's murder on the steps of a nearby church, that day really clarified that this work of equipping Christians and equipping the church to engage in these complex issues needed to happen now, it wasn't something we could push off, it wasn't something to do passively. It was something that needed to be done intentionally and on a larger scale than just articles here and there. It's been an absolute joy to build and develop this Center along with Christy and Ideos. We have an excellent team of advisors along with us, including the Center for Public Justice CEO Stephanie Summers, helping create this and move it forward.
CECPL’s three core values are: the Way of Empathy, intellectual humility, and mercy and hospitality. How did you identify these as what are needed in our current moment?
Empathy, intellectual humility, and hospitality are the three main values of the CECPL that we hold in doing this work. Included in that is what we have developed and call ‘the Way of Empathy’. That's the framework that we're working with, and also the concept of mercy. So starting with the Way of Empathy, it basically is a strategic way of thinking and doing that is rooted in Jesus' earthly ministry in the teachings of Scripture. And on one hand, it is a radical rejection and rebellion against the divisive polarizing powers that we see in our society today. But on the other hand, it's also an invitation to imagine new stories, create meaning through generative and constructive dialogue, and then actively pursue change. And so it basically has four elements to it. It begins with the attention and curiosity towards the diversity found in the world around us that we believe was intentionally created by God, and because we were made in diversity intentionally by God, it is something to be celebrated, not something to be ignored or overcome as if it was an obstacle to unity. Attention to this difference leads us into closer proximity to those who are outside of our native community or tribe. This time spent in the plurality of God's people then stirs in us a profound humility. And that’s the third element. Empathic humility involves a conscious realization that in our limited perspectives and imaginations, we have a lot to learn from those who are around us and from those who are outside of our tribes, even our religious tribes, that we have something to learn from those the Lord has placed around us, who are equally bestowed with the image of God. And finally, the cultivation of humility leads us to sacrifice: to give of ourselves for the other. That's the framework of the way of empathy that really all of our programming and such fits into. And so that's the first value.
The second value is intellectual humility, which we just talked about, it's rooted in this framework. It's the conscious awareness that we don't know everything, and that our perspectives are deeply limited. And so it's humility of our minds, it's humility that we don't know everything.
“This idea of sacrifice — that to know and understand one another, to have humility, inevitably puts us in a very vulnerable position.”
Then hospitality and mercy really emphasize the space making element of the work that we're doing, which is bringing people together across lines of difference, not to debate and to argue against one another, but to dialogue, that is to have conversation and to share stories for the purpose of learning from one another and to understand one another. And so those are kind of the three main emphases that we're that we're using to guide the work that we're doing.
[Identifying these values] came from looking at our world today, drawing from my own experiences as a seminarian, as an Indian American, as an adoptee, as someone who has resided in primarily white evangelical spaces for most of my life, growing up in the Midwest, attending Moody Bible Institute for my undergrad, and now being here at Princeton Seminary. And so, these three values of empathy, humility, and hospitality were things that I saw lacking in the circles and in the communities I was a part of, that contributed to this very divisive, disharmony of Christian witness, and especially for evangelicals. I mean, as those who take our name from the proclamation of the good news, we are frankly doing a really terrible job of witnessing to the gospel of Jesus Christ, because we aren't seeking to understand each other through empathy. We are, especially in primarily conservative white evangelical circles, upholding a certain practice or a certain expression of Christianity as the pinnacle or authoritative way to understand and practice the Christian faith, rather than approaching our faith with humility, saying that there are global practices of evangelicalism, let alone global practices of Christianity, that look very different from American evangelicalism. And we have a lot to learn from these people, as well. Then the hospitality element really contributes to the fact that we are so deeply polarized and so deeply tribalistic in our own tradition in that we aren't making space for the other and we aren’t willingly entering into the space of another with that intellectual humility and empathy. We have a deep lack of knowing one another. And so seeing these three issues spurred us to ask, “What are some solutions to this? What are values that can try to reverse the cycle or change the trajectory of where American evangelicalism or American Christianity is heading?”
What do you think the biggest barriers are for Christians to live in the Way of Empathy, and how does CECPL address these barriers?
I think the biggest barrier is the lack of relationships across lines of difference, and this is the toxic polarization, division, and tribalism that we've witnessed. Part of this is that we're so quick, myself included, to make assumptions and categorize other folks in a way that we can discount what they have to say.
This last year, we all moved online. We're having no human interaction. We're on Twitter and Facebook and watching the news through an election cycle and able to reduce people to names on a screen and truths, propositions, or ideas that they hold. Instead of seeing people in the fullness of their humanity and the complexities that come with that, and being equally bestowed with the image of God, we're able to put them into binaries of conservative and liberal, or traditional and progressive. And because someone is in one of these categories, in my mind, I can now discount what they have to say, rather than with charity, humility, and empathy listen to someone who I might disagree with and disagree with the argument that they're making rather than the box that I placed them in.
The CECPL intentionally fosters spaces to bring people together across lines of difference to have these conversations in a way that is generative and constructive rather than divisive, and in the context of a debate where we're not trying to disprove another or tear each other down, but learn from one another. And so we have our Communities of Practice, that's really the big program that seeks to do this, across the country, to bring together cohorts of seven to 10 people around an important issue where folks might not agree. We're bringing them together in the context of having conversation and learning from one another, not to debate and fight against one another for the sake of fighting. We equip Christians to do this at a local level. We also have a fellowship program, launching in 2022, that's going to do similar work. We also have resources like the Empathy Table podcast, where we talk to leaders who are modeling the Way of Empathy in the world.
How can CECPL’s core values inform how Christians approach political engagement?
This is a really important question. I think the mission that we are seeking to accomplish is to balance compassion, or mercy or empathy, and conviction. Of course, that's borrowing from the language of the AND Campaign who the CECPL is a really big fan of. But St. Augustine also uses this idea of compassion or mercy, or we might say empathy. In Latin, it is all the same word that connotates this idea: misericordia. But Augustine argues that compassion or empathy has a cognitive dimension that is enhanced by Christ-like love. It is a love that is incarnational, that suffers, that is subject to vulnerability. And that idea plays into the Way of Empathy and this idea of sacrifice — that to know and understand one another, to have humility, inevitably puts us in a very vulnerable position, that we might be wrong, that we might have to give up something, especially in the context of politics, in the context of systems, have to give up power and give up long established patterns of who is in control and who is subject to that control. But Augustine says that when we love rightly, we can see better and are able to respond to those who are around us. And so love and right reason work hand in hand. And of course, this has inherently political dimensions.
But Christians, and especially American evangelicals, have a long history of letting American politics dictate and define Christian orthodoxy rather than this Christ-like compassion or empathy that Augustine talks about. And you see this, of course, in the New Evangelical movement. At Princeton Seminary, I study American religious history and specifically postwar American evangelicalism. You see in this New Evangelical movement through the ways they deeply unite Christian faith and evangelical faith with American politics. You see in Billy Graham's crusades, how he has vice presidents and presidents and military leaders and elected officials come on stage for these Christian crusades to promote this uniting of Christian faith and American success or American expansion in this context of Americanism or Christian nationalism. And of course, this is all happening in the context of the Cold War, which is framed as a religious issue, which again, unites evangelical Christian faith with American politics, and so you see this trend. And this has implications for us today and the way that Christianity has moved forward.
But the point is that empathy, intellectual humility, and hospitality reject the idea that we can fit Christian faith into a single party platform and that Christian witness can be expressed fully through a single party, and instead encourages us to look to Jesus. But on the other hand, it doesn't mean that we're supposed to be apolitical. By no means does it say that we're not supposed to be involved in politics, because Christians have been called into the public square. Jesus did his ministry in the public square, as well as the apostles. And so there is inherently a political engagement element, from voting to activism to holding an elected office. We absolutely need Christians in these kinds of roles seeking to achieve this empathic vision for the American Church.
What role, if any, should elected officials play in promoting the Way of Empathy, intellectual humility, and hospitality? How should these values inform policy making?
I think elected officials can play a very large role in promoting these values. Of course, as Christians, we have very religious and deeply spiritual grounding for these values. We see these values in the biblical text. We see them, of course, in the life and ministry of Jesus, especially in the gospels. We see these stories of humility and hospitality and sacrifice and giving, taking up our cross and following Christ, giving to Caesar what is Caesar's, giving to God, what is God’s. And so we have spiritual, Christian grounding for these values. But also at a secular, even at a generally ethical level, these are just good values to have in democracy, and they promote the flourishing of all people. So I think that elected officials, especially Christian elected officials, can wholeheartedly embrace the weight of empathy, humility, and hospitality. And it's not for the sake of proselytizing or converting the citizens under their governance to the Christian faith. That's not the purpose of these values, especially in the context of being an elected official. But they can uphold these values because they contribute to a more inclusive and loving and welcoming society. And they can push against systems of oppression and injustice.
Why is the idea of empathy important for young people engaging in a pluralistic world? How can Christian young adults get involved with CECPL?
I think there's a very real and growing presence of young Christian leaders who are not only discontent with the trajectory of American Christianity, but motivated to make substantial and long-standing change. Even in historic conservative and evangelical institutions like the ones that I was formed in, there is a growing movement of students who are frustrated with the narrow imagination of Christian thought and practice that they've been given. Like I said earlier, this understanding that there is one faithful way to practice Christianity, and that all other practices of Christianity from different communities across the world, or even in the United States are peripheral. And so especially in our ideologically and religiously plural society, I think there's a growing movement of Christians, and especially younger Christians, who want to embrace this multi-vocal reality of Christian faith, and love their neighbors of all faith traditions well.
Empathy provides a framework in which to do this liberating work, especially in a way that does not fall back into the patterns of polarization and division in our society. And so in other words, it allows us to wholeheartedly and boldly tear down systems and theologies that oppress people, that marginalize communities, that silence people, but at the same time, we can invite those who hold such theologies into a new imagination, into a faithful vision of Christian life that doesn't reject or diminish the teachings of Scripture, but rather lives into them. And so I think that is what empathy, and especially the Way of Empathy, can do especially for young Christians seeking to make a difference in their society, in their local communities.
In terms of getting involved with CECPL’s work, there's a lot of different ways. We have open submissions for folks who'd like to write or create something with us. Anything from an op-ed article to a piece of artwork to sharing a sermon that they've written or that they've been putting together, we're happy to work with folks who want to make a change in their local communities, but also take the work that they're doing there and bring it on to a larger scale. We also, like I mentioned, have Communities of Practice. They’re small cohorts of Christians that gather together four times throughout the course of several months around this Way of Empathy. We come together to discuss and dialogue a prevalent issue in our society. It's always a group of folks who come from across the country, which makes for a really fascinating discussion around the ways that these large scale issues in our society play out at a local level, and especially within various congregations. But we gather together four times, we talk, and we use the Way of Empathy as a framework in which to have these conversations in a way that's productive. It’s very solutions-based in the sense that we work together, bring together our collective knowledge and experience and figure out a way to work towards solving these issues in some capacity in our local communities. We also have our fellows program for graduate students, seminarians, and early career scholars, and that's launching in 2022.
Amar D. Peterman is Director of the Ideos Center for Empathy in Christian and Public Life. He is also a graduate student at Princeton Theological Seminary, focusing his studies on American religious history. His writing and research have been published in Christianity Today, the Christian Century, Sojourners, the Berkley Forum, and more. Amar also holds a degree in Theology from Moody Bible Institute. You can follow his work on Twitter: @amarpeterman.
Lexi Schnaser is a student at Dordt University in Sioux Center, Iowa and is majoring in Political Science with a minor in Criminal Justice. She is the Shared Justice Program Assistant intern at the Center for Public Justice during the Summer of 2021.
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